Guest Post: I Won’t Apologize For Being Assaulted
Trigger Warning: Sexual Assault discussed frankly
Today’s guest post comes from the awesome Beth – “a recovering scenster 30something stay at home wife and mom. I listen to the Descendents from the comfort of my suburban home while cooking barefoot and pregnant to Bikini Kills Rebel Girl. I may not have it all figured out but im constsntly searching for a balance.”
According to sexual assault statistics, “One in four college-age women report surviving rape or attempted rape since their fourteenth birthday.” This is a pretty well known fact and probably won’t come to any surprise as I’m sure you, a girlfriend/boyfriend, ex, sibling, parent, child, teacher, babysitter, or neighbor in your life has been a victim. What might surprise you is how sexual assault can really inconvenience other people. No, seriously. I mean, what a total bummer to have to know that a friend of yours was manhandled by someone else – it just makes you feel bad, ya know? Or what a total drag to be friends with that certain someone who has been accused of this, I mean… jeez. Give you a break right? It’s not like they did it to you. You weren’t even there and I could totally be lying.
Wait. What? Let me go back…
I totally bum people out because I happened to have been sexually assaulted by the singer of a band they like. Like REALLY like. I know, I know. I should have tried harder for a band just begging to be rejected and ridiculed so it wouldn’t ruin your iPod rotation but hey, then again, it really wasn’t my choice. But man, what a total inconvenience to poor you to know something bad about a band you love. Just ignore the facts, I mean it WAS a long time ago. It’s not like I can still remember I was wearing cargo camo shorts and a v-neck white Hanes t-shirt… an outfit TOTALLY putting off do-me vibes with my freshly shaved head and not shaved legs and…wait. Hmmm.
Did you know I also make people feel awkward because I will openly post about my assault on Instagram or Facebook wherever I see mention of this band by “friends?” I mean…that must be really uncomfortable for them…me invading their personal space like that. Like the kind of invasion if someone were to pin them against a wall by shoving their hands down their pants from both the front and the back while pressing their entire body weight against 16-year-old, 90 lb. them as they cry and try to fight them off. No, no wait, it’s probably not like that but still. What a buzzkill. I mean, I should just learn to keep my mouth shut. I didn’t press charges so like…what right do I have STILL bringing it up? I’m sure he’s changed and moved on in life. I hear he’s a GREAT guy.
You know, it’s funny because…well, no it’s not. It’s not funny. It’s sad. It’s sad because there was a time in my life when I felt completely comfortable to confront a complete stranger, in person, wearing THIS BAND’s shirt or patch. I would tap them on the shoulder, look them in the eye and say “Hi, my name is Beth and the singer of THAT SHITTY NY PUNK BAND WITH SHITTY LARGE HAIR AND BONDAGE PANTS sexually assaulted me when I was 16. You may have heard rumors of him doing that before but from here on out you can never say you didn’t meet a victim and have the chance to hear their story.” Sometimes they’d want the details, sometimes they even admitted they had heard it about him before. The one amazing thing all of these complete strangers had in common was that they BELIEVED ME. They felt compelled to talk, cry, relate, or brainstorm. Like this was a totally fucked up thing that happened and we were not gonna sit by and take it anymore. In the end, 100% of the people I talked to removed the shirt/ patch/ pin/ etc of the band. One boy even took his shirt off and heaved it into a fire. All really small gestures to you, but to me it felt really empowering to tell my story. To have someone, through actions, say, “Yeah man. I’m on YOUR side.” “You can only be a victim if you admit defeat,” were words I lived by. These random faces gave me strength by standing behind me and… Yes, yes, true, we were younger then. Young, naive, full of energy, and allowances, so much more passionate about rights and wrongs and doing good. Plus, we totally weren’t in the middle of a beer with our friends and you know, I wasn’t “killing the vibe.” Or the shirt wasn’t “vintage,” and patches weren’t reaaally hard to come by. I mean that could totally be from their first tour – that’s worth SOMETHING. Barf.
So, ya know… now it’s been roughly 16 years since I was assaulted and that past will never change. I’m now a wife, a mother, a homeowner, a business owner, and yes still… I’m all of those things PLUS the girl that J___CoolBandLastName assaulted. In the many, many years that have passed, my need to speak about that night has never changed. Where once I traveled to fests far and wide and stood proud in my Bikini Kill shirts and screamed “Here I am, this happened.” I am now just a stay-at-home mom who finds time to look at Instagram between diaper changes and feels the need to leave a comment, “Oh, hey, that guy in that picture took away all sexual desires for 10 years by assaulting me, underage, at a friend’s house. He’s the reason I didn’t have healthy sexual relationships til my mid-20s. Oh and you look great, btw! xoxo bff ttyl. Cute kids! #hashtag #hashtag.” I dont have the time or sitter money to go out and yell anymore, but I still feel my own self-satisfaction because I won’t sit down and I won’t shut up.
In this time where the internet has made opinions widely available to the masses, I still feel like that one comment could reach 1,000 stranger eyes all from the comfort of my couch. While that’s a pretty far stretch of activism from the former life of ACTUALLY meeting people, where things REALLY changed were not my story/approach but the reactions. As we get older and nostalgia sets in, we reminisce about those old bands that got us here. We want to sing along and get sitters for weeknight shows because, dammit, we’re still young! And maybe some of us are still touring and we wouldn’t want to burn any bridges with bands we might get to play with… or maybe we are bar buddies with certain bands at far away fests and ya know.. might need a favor from them one day. Or book them to headline local friends’ fests in RVA because… I mean…they DO still draw a crowd. Yeah, sure, I get it. You’re lazy too. I expect a big reaction from you by only putting out a tiny tidbit of absolutely torturous information about my vulnerability and underage sexual experiences. But no, no, no. You’re right. Maybe if I marched in a parade, you’d at least “like” my photo but asking you to confront a friend or possibly not put other women in danger by bringing him around or NOT BUYING HIM BEERS AS IF HIS PRESENCE IN THIS TOWN WARRANTS CELEBRATION. I…ugh. I’m tired too. Maybe we’re just too old to give a shit anymore. If only there were a way to repost meaningless online articles for masses to see by clicking one button that in turn puts an unheard story out for millions of new eyes to read from the comfort of a computer chair. Then and only then might I get a little support but… wait no, no. It’s still just he said-she said. And really… what if it got back to him? It might make a situation awkward. Awkward like having someone shove the back of your head at their crotch while trying to explain, “It’s just a little 1,2,3 you can do it,” while you put all your strength in your arms to steady your weight and almost bite through your tongue trying to ensure your mouth is locked… Oh no. No, wait….
Well, guess what everyone. Here I sit during nap time, comfortable in bed, laptop open, protesting in my own half-assed way as your friend. Or maybe I WAS your friend before I moved out of the city to start a family. Maybe I was only ever just your bartender, waitress, checkout girl, seamstress, childcare provider, ex-girlfriend, show promoter, charity worker, show goer, or even just the girl in the bar seat next to you. But here’s who else I am: I am the survivor of a sexual assault at the age of 16 by a man more than 10 years older than me. This man cornered me in a room and tried to force me to perform sexual acts on him, stating he would tell everyone in the van I did it anyway so I might as well. When I fled the room, he chased me down the hall, pinning me against a wall and shoving his hands down every orifice he could find while shoving his mouth over mine to prevent my muffled screams and tears from being heard. When I eventually broke free, I locked myself in an abandoned room until friends came to me. I slept in that room only to be disturbed once by a band member who simply knocked on the door and said, “You don’t have to open the door, just listen. You don’t even have to tell me what happened because I already know and I’m really sorry.” And I’m not sorry if YOU CAN’T HANDLE THAT.
When I came out that next morning, 16 years ago, the band was gone, my wallet was stolen, and I was left a shirt by the band as if it were some sort of consolation prize. The irony of the band’s name, and me being a CASUALTY in my own right, was not lost on me. All these years later and every time I write those words, speak them, re-live them, I choke back vomit. I remember how The Singer smelled, tasted, his jagged rotten teeth, his worn leather skin, how the band argued about not cutting their hair because it was their statement, and mostly how utterly fucking helpless I felt. How scared, dirty, ashamed, used, rejected, confused, alone, and ruined I felt. I feel all those emotions when my friends play shows and fests with this man. When they put their arms around him at bars, when they defend him. Hell, I feel all this just because he simply still breathes. Through my travels, I met other girls and heard their stories and know that no justice has ever been served. Not legally, not musically, not even a small road bump in his band or his shitty pathetic life. And now… now I’m at fault for telling my story again I’m sure because man…you already bought those show tickets and they WERE $30.00 and you don’t want that going to waste. Yeah, I get it. I told. I’m the bad guy.
Well, fuck you Jorge. Fuck you and your shitty band. I don’t want to be your victim or storyteller. I want to be the wife of my husband and mother of my son without ever wearing your memory. But I can’t. What I can do is raise a man who respects women and their boundaries, but even then your shitty legacy will live on behind the reasons and examples I lay out for my son. I’m not your victim, asshole. I’m your survivor. And this is my story and if it makes you, friend, uncomfortable, well then at least we share some common feelings for once. Ya know…”I’m so sorry if I’m alienating some of you, your whole fucking culture alienates me.”
MOD NOTE: Thanks for all the support!! We’re happy we could give Beth a space to share her story. We love how quickly this story has spread, and hope it’s making an impact.
That being said, this is a tiny blog run by a group of friends in our spare time. We’re not really equipped to handle all of this activity. I’m trying to monitor and approve comments as they come in, but I have to sleep and work, so some may take awhile. Please please please keep things civil, no threats of violence, that sort of thing, I want to let everyone (except for obvious trolls) say their piece.
And, as we hear from more people on other sites, please keep things cool elsewhere. It’s amazing to hear some of the actions people are taking – from simply sharing this to being inspired to admit their own assault. But, again, please don’t threaten violence or any sort of criminal act. We’re better than that, unlike the abusers and assaulters of this world, we can actually use our minds to make a difference.
Thank you again!!
-The Damn Pants Team
Put Your Damn Pants On! 
since they are deleting comments from their facebook page i recommend posting this link on twitter with #thecasualties or @TheCasualties
There is also a facebook page http://www.facebook.com/boycottthecasualties
As Christina said, it is a cultural problem. I always believed in punk rock as a safe haven for those of us who felt failed by society in whatever way. A way to unify, to find friendship and community when we couldn’t elsewhere. Reading what Jenny said, that punk rock is not a culture that openly empowers women is an incredibly disgusting truth. I don’t mean to sound as though it is something I find “inconvenient,” but something that I find deeply paining. With every unwillingness to combat inequality, injustice and violence in our own (sub)culture, the more we become exactly like the culture we sought to leave behind. We have to strive for better. Period.
Beth,
I don’t want to say that I am sorry, for I feel that’s like squeezing lemon juice on an open wound. I wanted to say you should be proud for surviving, and for being able to share your story, and for doing your part to bring this to light. Don’t ever stop screaming. Don’t EVER apologize.
Malcolm
Wait. First of all, to speak of punk as whole, unified, organized thing is deeply wrong. That said, gender equality had an important role in punk culture since its beginnings and of all music-based cultures or scenes, I feel it is one of those where women have been empowered the most.
Maybe there’s a problem in the punk scene of your town, state or even country, but to blame the culture itself it’s wrong. I’ve been part of my town punk scene for some years, and I have nothing but positive remarks to make in that field.
Jorge is an adult man and he is fully responsible for his actions, and those who knew are responsible for not stopping him, and they all should pay. But I don’t think it’s fair to extend his sins on all of us just because we are male punks.
Frank
Hi Frank- you’re right about Jorge being fully responsible for his actions, as well as those who knew not stopping him, but I also don’t think that his actions do not call into question the flaws of punk culture. Many people feel that punk represents freedom (I’m widely categorizing it) but that does not mean that it is not problematic, and that punk culture can still give birth to elements and actions reflective of rape culture. To preserve the message and integrity of punk culture, male punks should be aware that within punk culture there is this distinct imperfection, most often perpetuated by men, and therefore, male punks. I believe the author was trying to call attention to men in this culture having the responsibility to be aware that there is still this male-dominated pattern even within punk culture. The Punk Scene, no matter how divergent and powerfully so, from dominant culture, is still connected to the dominant culture, even as a counter-culture, and it does damage to the Punk Community to pretend that it does not have distinct elements and can even act as a breeding ground for rape and assault. Furthermore, Punk Culture can harbor its shadow element of entitlement; it cannot and should not attempt to escape through self-myth the reality that it too, can allow for rape culture. In this case, this guy used his presence in the Punk Community as a kind of entitlement and empowerment, as well as a way to remain invisible as a perpetrator of sexual assault. That’s not to say Punk Culture is responsible for giving him the sensibility (or lack thereof), to do what he did, but it still created a space for someone to do it in, meaning it is not without some accountability, and thus the responsibility to be aware of its shortcomings, and problems. The act of one man, or even a group, does not define a culture at large, but it would be very COUNTER Punk culture to not say, “that’s wrong and we don’t allow this here.” He should be called out, especially by other male punks, and completely kicked out. He should not be allowed to be part of the Punk Community. Otherwise, your vision of seeing the Punk Scene as a place for female empowerment is impossible. I also want to point out that while its a wonderful thing to envision the Punk Scene as empowering to women, as a man, and applaud you for your consideration, can you truly speak to and understand this issue, and the conditions of such? Thanks for reading.
Hi Frank- you’re right about Jorge being fully responsible for his actions, as well as those who knew not stopping him, but I also don’t think that his actions do not call into question the flaws of punk culture. Many people feel that punk represents freedom (I’m widely categorizing it) but that does not mean that it is not problematic, and that punk culture can still give birth to elements and actions reflective of rape culture. To preserve the message and integrity of punk culture, male punks should be aware that within punk culture there is this distinct imperfection, most often perpetuated by men, and therefore, male punks. I believe the author was trying to call attention to men in this culture having the responsibility to be aware that there is still this male-dominated pattern even within punk culture. The Punk Scene, no matter how divergent and powerfully so, from dominant culture, is still connected to the dominant culture, even as a counter-culture, and it does damage to the Punk Community to pretend that it does not have distinct elements and can even act as a breeding ground for rape and assault. Furthermore, Punk Culture can harbor its shadow element of entitlement; it cannot and should not attempt to escape through self-myth the reality that it too, can allow for rape culture. In this case, this guy used his presence in the Punk Community as a kind of entitlement and empowerment, as well as a way to remain invisible as a perpetrator of sexual assault. That’s not to say Punk Culture is responsible for giving him the sensibility (or lack thereof), to do what he did, but it still created a space for someone to do it in, meaning it is not without some accountability, and thus the responsibility to be aware of its shortcomings, and problems. The act of one man, or even a group, does not define a culture at large, but it would be very COUNTER Punk culture to not say, “that’s wrong and we don’t allow this here.” He should be called out, especially by other male punks, and completely kicked out. He should not be allowed to be part of the Punk Community. Otherwise, your vision of seeing the Punk Scene as a place for female empowerment is impossible. I also want to point out that while its a wonderful thing to envision the Punk Scene as empowering to women, as a man, and applaud you for your consideration, can you truly speak to and understand this issue, and the conditions of such? Thanks for reading.
Just because its a punk scene doesn’t mean its exempt from issues regarding the rest of society. I, too, have been part of the punk scene for about 10 years. Ive been to shows around the world…not just in my city or country and I can tell you this problem is in every punk group. Just because you weren’t effected by it yourself do not be blind to the fact that someone you know may have been. Your reality isn’t the end all be all. No where I saw in the article did the author point her finger at all male punks….please don’t think of it personally…think of it globally. Just because punk is founded on some really awesome ideals don’t romanticize it into a utopian culture. Punk is affected by reality…and there are a lot of ass holes in this community that are more interested in groupies than in equality. You may not be one of them and that’s great but denying the existence of inequality and sexual assault in the community just makes you an ignorant good guy.
I’ve always thought of punk as a unified thing. I realize there are different groups within it and such, but I have always felt that it was, at least, in the ideal, a unified community. What was relevant in the beginning of punk rock is not something I can speak to, but whether or not it was a big deal back then, except to say that I know the Slits did say that they would get treated like sex objects. But that was 40 years ago. What may have or not been true then, is not necessarily true now. We need to focus on the now. My particular scene has a lot of issues, though I don’t think gender issues are the worst certainly not the best. That said, if one country has problems with gender inequality in it’s punk rock culture, that is a large percent of people, and it is a big issue. We can’t minimize something like that. That’s a huge chunk of the culture. And while I can’t speak to Europe’s punk scene, I can’t imagine the countries or Europe as a whole is a utopia in which this is not an issue. I’ll be honest; I think your town is the outlier, not the average example. I think every one of my female friends has a least one example of being groped at shows, while crowdsurfing, etc. One of my friends had a guy come up behind her and literally just shove his hands down her pants. Jorge is an adult man and he is responsible for his own actions. I definitely don’t dispute that. However, looking, in particular on the Boycott the Casualties facebook page and seeing the massive amount of negativity, of slut-shaming, etc points to a problem in the way the culture thinks as a whole. I’m not saying we’re all responsible for his actions, or for the words of slut-shamers. We are responsible for speaking up for victims and for telling people that it is wrong to treat women that way. It is our town, our state, our country, our scene. We have the responsibility to make it better. If we all do something in our own little corner of the world, we can make a difference.
“it felt really empowering to tell my story.” truly inspirational.
Thank you for sharing your story. I was sexually assaulted by a neighbor when I was 13 and I haven’t talked about it since I was 14 because people felt awkward and didn’t know what to say to me. I haven’t had a relationship last more than 6 months and I’m 22 now. I guess I never realized how much that man took away from me. But thank you for opening that wound it needs to be properly mended not ignored. I will share your story, people should know about Jorge.
how is this comment still here? a woman states that she was sexually assaulted and instead of supporting her or just ignoring it, you tell her to ‘keep her COCKSUCKER shut’? you are the worst kind of troll.
Please don’t be weak. Nothing can take away your you. And never ever feel awkward or apologize for someone abusing you. You keep speaking until someone listens. Im sorry this happened to you. But stay strong! Dont let this control your life. Be well hun
Excellent. Thank you for your courage. I’d never heard any of this about that person (probably because I don’t follow the band closely) and the fact that a lot of other women have come out discussing this means that this is an on-going preference with him, not a tragic mistake.
I feel so let down as I read on… Wow. These are the sorts of things that need to be accepted.
While I know it might not be much, I just linked this article on every post on their facebook page that I could before I was blocked from posting. At least a few of their fans will see it before my comments get deleted. I am also sharing it on my page. Sad to hear that people have any negative response toward you at all, and so sad that as a community we haven’t closed this band down.
Makes sense why the local venue in our area went from all ages to 19+ in the blink of an eye.
For this show only
Wow, I’m totally appalled and disgusted. I can’t say I’ve ever been a fan of theirs, but definitely know many who are. I have no interest in hearing this POS try to defend himself. There is no excuse. I am proud to have quite a few friends calling him out on the band’s fb page. Even if they are deleting and blocking comments and people, the internet is a plethora of information and opinions. I’m sure your story has or will save some girl/woman from carrying similar terrifying memories. They are officially on my band to boycott list. I will voice my opinion to anyone on this matter. I hope that more healing vibes your way.
I have also started a facebook community with ideas of how to spread the word and inform people. Once again, it may not be much, but its a start, right? If you’re interested in checking it out, the page is http://www.facebook.com/boycottthecasualties
why dont you wait till you know the full story before starting such a group?!
Because the Casualties don’t really seem interested in opening up a dialog about this issue and seem quite content to shut down any attempts to discuss it.
Uh, this is the full story as far as I’m concerned.
Really? Like Jorge is going to have a rational explanation for this? DOes that guy say “rational” to you? Just listening to his band, which I’ve never liked anyway, gives me the impression that he’s not about to have a dialogue with anyone, just yell at you and force you to see things his way.
I’m with you Mandy. Well said.
Sad to read that some guy groped you. He had no right to do that. It has affected you so deeply. Seek counseling, a professional might be able to help you heal and move forward from your trauma.
That’s truly shocking. I’ve been a Casualties fan for a long time and had the honour of sharing a stage with them when they came to the UK once. I’d welcome Jorge’s comments on the matter, after all this is only one person’s side to the story. I guess it would help if other people came forward with their accounts because this type of behaviour must be exposed.
I imagine that this could be true but for now I will keep an open mind because it’s the fairest thing to do. The internet is a very powerful tool and has been used to spawn rumours since its birth. We have one person’s word right now, so who are we to play judge, jury and executioner?
Don’t get me wrong, I am NOT jumping to Jorge’s defence I’m simply asking people to be rational. If this IS true, then I have great sympathy for Beth and will never look upon The Casualties in the same way again. I’d urge Jorge and the rest of the band to come forward to speak about it rather than ignoring the matter. I notice that they are simply deleting the link from their Facebook page rather than commenting on it to defend themselves. If it was me I would be defending my integrity vigorously, so if anything, the bands actions are leading me to lean towards Beth right now.
My exact thoughts
I’ve been told similar stories of Jorge and his behavior towards girls/women by several close friends in the scene over the years. Beth’s story is not merely an “accusation”, it is an account of what happened to her.
Oh hell… I was at a show (not punk… drum ‘n’ bass, ironically) literally not more than 4 hours ago where some chick had punk jacket with a Casualties patch on it. I complimented her on it because I the last D’n’B show I had gone to I spiked my mohawk (I normally wear it combed to one side so it appears vaguely within “professional”-ish bounds for work… STILL YOUNG, DANGIT!!!) and all I got was weird “wtf-is-this-guy-doing” type stares if people reacted to it at all, so I wanted to give her some positive feedback for whatever it was worth. Now I feel all dirty for doing that.
Also reminds me of some shit I heard a long time ago about one of the guys from Bad Religion… can’t remember the story exactly and can’t find any articles on it anymore, but that was the singular moment when my enthusiasm for 99.9% of everything punk died, since they were my favorite band at the time. I still think about them and that time in my life fondly every now and again, only to remember why it stopped…
I’m sad now. 😥
At any rate, though, add me to the list of people who can’t stand this sort of hypocrisy from people who project an image of themselves as “above” the ills of modern society in some way. As a guy who would love nothing more than for true gender equality and general peace among the human population to be realized, I can’t stand this type of shit. Makes people like me have to work 10 x harder to even be heard, no matter the merit of our ideas.
This article unfortunately really hit home for me. A little over a year ago I spoke out about Bones Delarge from The Lower Class Brats, who at the time were touring with The Casualties. You can read the details of how he assaulted me here but please be aware that it’s a major TRIGGER WARNING because there are unmoderated responses from very privileged people and also Delarge himself.
http://www.anarcho-punk.net/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=8954&hilit=Lower+Class+Brats
Elizabeth, I am so sorry this happened to you but thank you a million times for speaking out about it. I have so much love for you.
Opps, I mean Beth.. not Elizabeth though I have lots of love for you too for having to moderate all these comments!
MOD NOTE: Thanks for all the support!! We’re happy we could give Beth a space to share her story. We love how quickly this story has spread, and hope it’s making an impact.
That being said, this is a tiny blog run by a group of friends in our spare time. We’re not really equipped to handle all if this activity. I’m trying to monitor and approve comments as they come in, but I have to sleep and work, so some may take awhile. Please please please keep things civil, no threats of violence, that sort of thing, I want to let everyone (except for obvious trolls) say their piece.
Thank you again!!
There is a really deplorable comment from oscarweasel333 up above, in response to Alexa’s comment. I’d imagine you have just missed it because of how busy everything is, but I really do believe it should be removed. Thank you for helping spread this story, and for all of your hard work.
Done, thank you!
You’re a strong woman, and a bad ass. Just wanted to let you know their Facebook page is blowing up with hate because of this. Going to screenshot it before they delete it and send it to the email given below.
This was incredible to read. I can’t tell you how many times I have tried to convince myself to “just get over it” from my own assaults. What’s worse is that others have told me I need to just get over it, too, and can’t understand why it still torments me to this day. It was YEARS ago. It shouldn’t effect me. It shouldn’t matter… But it does. Every day. It is never not going to be in my past, I just need to be empowered by it, not trapped. You have inspired me greatly. Thank you.
This was incredible to read. I can’t tell you how many times I have tried to convince myself to “just get over it” from my own assaults. What’s worse is that others have told me I need to just get over it, too, and can’t understand why it still torments me to this day. It was YEARS ago. It shouldn’t effect me. It shouldn’t matter… But it does. Every day. It is never not going to be in my past, I just need to be empowered by it, not trapped. You have inspired me greatly. Thank you.
I have never heard of this band but will re-post on your behalf to make the world aware.
I am so sorry this happened to you. I had a similar experience with someone that was touring on the road when I was younger. I didn’t bother going to the cops because they were on tour, it seemed like a wasted day at the police station for something they wouldn’t care about. The backlash on their Facebook is amazing though, I hope you find some comfort in all the people, including myself, that are so angry about this happening to you! I hope it at least hurts their numbers on tour.
I’m sorry – this may or may not be true, and I don’t think that’s the point at hand. I reserve judgement one way or the other, because unlike most people, I don’t go off blindly because something is posted on the internet. Regardless, this piece is so manipulative. All I got from reading this is that if I were a fan of The Casualties (which I’m not at all, by the way) and still wanted to be after reading this, I’d be a bad person – almost as if I’d be letting down the author, as well as every other woman who had ever been raped or assaulted. That’s manipulative and, frankly, bull. I don’t know this person. I can feel for what this story is saying, but that doesn’t mean it’s going to instantly change my opinion on something. The part where she went up to someone wearing a shirt, told them the story, and they supposedly burned it? Yeah, that’s exactly what is going on right now digitally. This article is everywhere, and people are blindly following it. Again, I’m not saying it’s not something that happened, but if you follow along like sheep, just taking everything at face value, and your whole existence can be changed like that, you’ve got more problems than need to be spoken of. If someone told me that my favorite band raped someone, well – that’s too bad. Would I immediately stop listening to them? No. And I don’t think that any long-time fan of this band really will either. Because it’s music, and it’s one guy in the band.
Since I’m a guy and this is just full of women and feminists, I’m expecting this not even to get approved, but if it does, the flaming will start regardless. My whole point basically here is this: think for yourself. If you want to like a band, like a band. Someone else’s tragedy shouldn’t be dictating your life, or else we’d all be sitting around in silence being offended.
MOD NOTE: Again, please keep thing civil! Supporter or not, I’ll start deleting comments if things get out of hand. Thanks, all, discuss away…E
Manipulative, huh? Sort of like forcing yourself on numerous girls and women and then using your status as a notable figure in a popular band to veil your true monstrosity? That kind of manipulative?
Yeah, right.
yeah what is manipulative is society telling me i have to accept this kind of behavior. i think for myself. i realize that we haven’t heard the other side yet. everything about this rings true, and i’m glad others are coming forward. please encourage the singer of this band to respond to these allegations, lots of people want to hear what he and the rest of the band have to say. maybe it is because you are a man, and maybe because you have never experienced systematic and personal sexual violence against you, or not, but for me my disgust at learning what someone does against underage women would cause me to not enjoy listening to their music, punk rock to me is about fighting oppression, not causing it. let them respond to this, we are waiting. my guess is they will deny it, imply that all of these women are mentally unstable and delusional. but it is obvious to me so far that isn’t the case. it is also obvious to me that men in positions of power will rape and then cover it up. it’s an old story. what is new is women speaking up, receiving support and the community holding rapists accountable. that is something i am for ❤
It’s not just one guy in a band that’s a problem. It’s the fact that people are spending their money to support a rapist. You don’t know the fear of walking down a dark alley at night knowing others see your body as a piece of property for the taking. You don’t know what it means to feel empty and hollow and worthless. You’ve never felt the shame of thinking that if you “just fought a little harder” it wouldn’t have happened. So to you it might be just a guy in a band, but to others it’s watching a glorified rapist capture the hearts and minds of people, giving him a platform when you feel like you don’t have one, giving him power when he stole yours.
If someone told you that your favourite band had stolen another band’s gear, had screwed the other bands on a bill out of their cut of the door, had caused a scene and gotten the venue shut down, would you keep on loving and supporting that band, or would you decide thay hey, maybe they’re not the greatest and don’t deserve to be my favourite band? You never saw cash change hands, or not change hands. All bass amps look the same, to you. You don’t know. It’s probably just hearsay.
What if they’d robbed someone. Shot someone. Killed someone. Would ANY of that change your perspective of the band, and the people in it? Or is sexual assault the only crime that bandmembers (or anyone else) never have to be held accountable for?
This is a heartbreaking story about a terrible occurrence. I’m sorry you’ve been forced to experience this.
A word of warning for everyone here, though: Not all men are terrible. Not all aggressors are men. Not all punk communities/scenes are safe-havens for sexual assaulters (that word sounds incorrect but I don’t know what else to say). It’s easy to paint with a broad brush with subjects and discussions like these. Individual people are just that: individuals making individual choices. His choice impacted the OP very negatively. Most other people wouldn’t have made that same choice.
As a male who is a lifelong punk fan but has never sexually assaulted someone, I can’t help but feel terrible for you and your situation.
I just posted this to Facebook so others don’t have to have the same experience you did.
Thank you for sharing. Hopefully each time you speak out or speak up you’ll heal a little more.
Yeah, because unless you explain that not all men are rapists, what every woman will get from this story is that every man is a rapist.
How stupid do you think women are? Your desire to be supportive is noted, but so is the insult.
I wasn’t talking exclusively to women. I was talking anyone who might read it: someone outside the punk community looking in with newfound disdain, a male who might be ashamed of being assaulted because “only men rape” who needs a reminder, a woman who might be afraid of men, etc.
But, to answer your question – I think women are no dumber than I am. I think people are no dumber than I am.
My first reaction was anger towards a group of people. Of course, my second thought was a reminder to myself that this was an individual, not a group of people.
I just wanted to remind everyone of what I had to remind myself.
You are an amazingly strong woman! I commend you so so much for sharing your story, refusing to be a victim. You are an amazing survivor! Sending you so much love! 🙂
Trial by internet. Gotta love it.
Those of you that are blindly accepting this as fact and sharing the story are the reason why things get so out of hand on the internet! I reiterate that I’m not jumping to Jorge’s defence, it’s just sad that so many of you are taking someone’s side so quickly.
Note: I *PERSONALLY* know someone that lied in great detail about being raped. The police launched a full investigation and an image of the alleged offender was printed in the local paper. It was only when the ‘victim’ contradicted herself that one of the officers picked holes in the story and she eventually confessed that NOTHING actually happened. She had made the whole thing up. True story.
I also know a couple more people that lie through their teeth with astonishing conviction, so forgive me for being slightly sceptical when I don’t accept the word of someone I’ve never met.
I thought we belonged to a society where people are innocent until proven guilty? You’re taking us back to witch-burning times here, so do yourselves a favour and think carefully before you spread stuff like this.
Again, if this DID happen then I hope Beth finds a way to leave it behind and live a happy life with her family. I would also expect the guilty party to be charged accordingly.
If someone told you they had been stabbed and shown you the scar wouldn’t you believe them? Well she’s telling you she was raped and showing you the scar.
Guilty until proven innocent, huh? What, are you cop?
We know there are some people who lie about assault of all kinds, and that really sucks for the accused. But that’s part of the reason we need more people to stand up and tell their stories. Survivors of abuse are scared to admit it publically partly because of responses like this. Why should “innocent until proven guilty” be applied only to the abuser? Why can’t that apply to the person saying what happened? This is ingrained in our culture and what we talk about when we talk about abuse. I doubt that you’re a bad person, or would want a repeat offender to continue to hurt others simply because we need both sides of the story to make a judgement. I just wanted to point out why so many people get upset with this line of reasoning.
And – if we were contacted by the accused, the band or their management, we’d definitely consider posting a statement if it fit in to the tone of this personal blog. But, again, this isn’t a court, we have no responsibility to have both sides share. Our goal was and is to let people share their truth, not to ruin a band. That seems to be happening because of their actions. -E
Fair comment. Sorry for my outburst, i noticed the comments on the Les Paul site and it annoyed me. I mentioned in my first comment that the bad should come forward and i hope they do.
I just wanted to thank you for sharing your story. I’m sorry that you had to experience something so horrible. You didn’t outright say the name of the band, but I know who it is, and I assure you that I will not support such disgusting behavior, and I will remind people of what kind of band they are .
This is getting some traction over on http://www.reddit.com/r/punk, folks may wanna stop by over there and upvote for visibility, reddit can be a fantastic catalyst to get shit done.
I added this to every post sometimes under the same post by another decent human on their FB page I could before I got booted for spamming and mentioned to FB that this page is an avenue for a person sexual assaulting underage girls for the lat 15+ years. Fuck that band. Next thing to do would be contacting their record labels with this story. Stay strong and live on.
Beth,
I am your sister in more ways that you will ever know. I am a survivor, not a victim as well. I love you from all the way in Florida. This kind of thing happens all too often, and I am so thankful for your courage and honesty.
-Jordan Maret
I hope that this causes some interesting changes. I hope they kick him out and replace him with Mike Virus. I would pay money to see that. That would be pretty funny, Mike Virus doing casualties songs because Jorge was a rapist.
I am still going to enjoy their music only because I did for a decade before finding this out, so sue me. Anyway, these guys have always been the butt of jokes to some extent. Now they have more reasons to be laughed at.
This is such an eye opening post. I really hope everyone reads it.
And for the punks, listen up, there are so many great punk bands out there. It wouldn’t take much to give up listening to this shit band and find other good music.
beth, thank you for sharing your truth, your story. i would think it is validating and empowering to hear other women coming forward, and i hope they agree to share their story with you. i’m sorry that you had to experience something like that; being a victim is never a fun experience. stay strong, stay positive, and turn that victimization into something better. be a voice for other women, be a wonderful wife and mother, be an excellent person. i’m also sorry that some people are asshats and feel the need to put you on some sort of trial for a blog post. i suppose that’s the double edged sword of the internet. much love ❤
You underestimate my cynicism. Also, her ‘scar’ is a statement, which makes crimes of this nature hard to prove. Having said that, i am not so cold that i don’t feel pain for victims of abuse. Been there. I must add that your response to Heirfur’s comment above hit me hard and you put it in a way that I’ve never been able to. By no means am i calling Beth a liar, i just find the whole internet justice thing rather harsh.
Crimes like this are notoriously hard to prove. It’s difficult to prove that he did it, let alone that the survivor didn’t want it, and that’s what rape culture thrives upon. I was nonconsensually groped and I’m grateful by friends were supportive because there wasn’t physical proof.
Beth,
Thank you for sharing this. I have shared this on Twitter, Facebook, and Tumblr. When I was 17, I went to my very first punk show to see The Casualties. Jorge hit on me that night. I was so confused because I was the least punk looking chick there. I just kind of walked away from him… I’m glad I did. It makes me fucking sick that you had to go through this. I have the unfortunate experience in being sexually assaulted in my own apartment. I know how it feels to be sexually dead. I’m still battling that to this day. You are not alone, and you are amazing for sharing this.
Your sister in punk,
Heather
Nothing to it but to do it, Beth ;). Good on you, take this shit all the way to his front door.
i am saddened to read this. i’m replying in the hopes that how i handled myself will provide some aid and peace to beth.
please get a counselor. for me, i found one through a pro-choice, lgbt-friendly sexual health clinic. (planned parenthood is a good start, too) not all counselors have good intentions, so it’s best to choose wisely. the one i found was what i like to call ‘sex positive’. this means non-judgemental and willing to assist me to reach a place in my life where i could be a sexually healthy person, despite what had happened. i would not be where i am today if i hadn’t reached out to that fantastic clinic, who was appalled at the treatment i received in the er. believe me, i received less than stellar care at an emergency room i went to, where i was told ‘well, what were you doing being around people like that?! you need to watch yourself’ well gee, old bitch rn,f i thought it was going to happen, i wouldn’t have fucking been there! my counselor was fantastic. i am grateful for us crossing paths. the only sad thing is i have had to send other women in similar situations as me who also did not get the proper help they needed 😦 it breaks my heart.
please surround yourself in positive situations that won’t trigger the negative feelings of this assault. for me, i picked up gardening and charity work. even going outside and just admiring a beautiful day brought me piece of mind. being around positive people with goals towards helping others boosted my self esteem and has put me on a better path towards healing. by helping my community, i do not have those feelings of self-loathing.
i can’t promise this advice will fix everything, but i do hope it will lessen the pain some, as it did for me. *big hugs*
Because your paragraph of insults is the perfect rebuttal for someone’s rape testimony. On the fucking internet of ALL fucking places.
thank you for having the courage to tell of your suffering, zero tolerance for these selfish criminals this 1 in 4 statistic needs to change it’s just not acceptable, keep up the good work spreading your truth
spreading the truth.. thanks for opening up!
I remember I had always wanted to go to a Casualties show. They were such a “NJ/NY Punk” thing to see. Before ever going to a show, however, I heard some rumors about the gross behaviour of the band. Almost immediately I gave up my quest to pursue that band further. I never gave them any money if I could avoid it, I was so disgusted. What was weirder, was how many people that I know KNEW about this continued to support these guys. It definitely is infuriating 😦
I was called a poser at times for not liking them, not understanding what “real punk” was. I can only imagine how infuriating it must be for you. I’m glad you have stuck to your guns and have come out to talk about it. Perhaps other young girls will be able to avoid a bad situation so long as they heed your words.
Thank you for speaking up. and fuck those who tell you to shut up about it.
Thank you for speaking up, and fuck anyone who doesn’t want to hear it
Why didn’t you press charges for theft? Did you attempt to press charges on the assault? I only ask because I don’t doubt your story, but in the same sense you let him go on another 16 years doing it to others without as much as even starting a paper trail on the guy. Did this happen in the US? Did you investigate if even a statutory assault type of law could’ve been investigated? Finally (and not to sound like the church lady), where were your parents amidst all of this? How long before you told any of your friends? I recommend addressing these if only for other victims who may currently be going through in 2013 what you went through in 1997.
I’d like to point out that Beth (or any victim of assault or abuse) did not “allow” him to continue, just like she didn’t allow the assault in the first place. I understand the sentiment of this line of reasoning, but he has the responsibility to NOT assault people, and placing blame on victims takes away the fault of the abuser. And the same goes for asking about her parents.
As a sexual assault survivor myself (and I’m male btw), I find your response disheartening and vain at best. You should be advising other victims what actions to take, even if they weren’t actions you yourself took, either out of not being able to or simply not thinking of it until later. I have never liked this poser Exploited wannabe band, but all the same time, these 10 paragraphs of 1900+ words only amount to “Don’t support the Casualties, they’re bad people and you will be too”. And nothing positive or being supportive or giving advice on help.
For everyone else: REPORT the crime. They may walk but it’s a noted incident and it’s link in a chain that eventually brings them down. Also visit or call TryNova (http://trynova.org) or http://rainn.org There are better authorities to bring justice than the internet.
I talk about this a lot with the kids who I work with. If you think it’s hard getting the average assault victim to come forward, try getting a punk or a street/travelling kid to come forward – not just about sexual assault, but about ANYTHING. They’re disposed to hate and distrust the cops (rough estimate on number of punk spaces you can walk in to that have “trust the PoPo” scrawled on the walls, not “fuck the police.” Go ahead. I’ll wait.), and the cops, them. They feel disenfranchised about the crime, let alone about justice, before an investigation can even get started. Tell an adult? WHAT adult? In a scene like this, there are very few trusted adult figures that these kids can go to. Get a paper trail started? How? If you assaulter is part of a touring band, by the time you can get a paper trail going, they’re across a time zone and out of the jurisdiction. They may be street kids themselves, and not have a real address. The scene of the crime, as it were, is likely an illegal club/show space, and it may not even exist next week. Or maybe it happened at a festival, and the location where it occurred has already been torn down and turned back in to a parking lot.
I’m not trying to attack you, I just want to bring up the fact that punk defends and vilifies its own. Part of the problem is that if someone doesn’t feel comfortable speaking up about the problem to their own in-group (and punk is often so insular that that can be REALLY problematic and difficult, for the exact reasons that the author of this post has mentioned), it’s even harder to bring it to official channels.
Beth’s post has just made it obvious how difficult speaking up can be. People are more concerned with defending her assualter’s reputation, with making sure this doesn’t upset “the scene,” than with hearing Beth’s story. If we, as a scene, want to end the rape culture that exists within it, we can’t keep stringing victims up for coming forward. Sexual assault will always have two sides – the victim, and the assailant. But if we sit around and wait for the assailants to come forward to address the crime, and blame the victims for speaking up, we’re just going to keep enabling the cycle.
*applause*
Thank you for speaking out, and know there are still perfect strangers who have your back. Fuck him, and everyone who has defended/covered for him for 2 decades.
FUCK TE REST, U ARE DAMN RIGHT.
>claim is posted by an anonymous source only known as beth
>claims in her story that over 16 years she has openly discussed it with people and posted about her assault on facebook and instagram though she submits it anonymously to a blog
>story is vague and leaves out important details like the date, city and show
>talks about being groped but decides to stay and hang out with the band anyway even though she is uncomfortable
>band has been around for over 20 years and this is the very first person to talk about it and they are anonymous
>band has been around for over 20 years and no victims have ever thought to make a report to police, write their story in a feminist zine, etc.
>story comes from an anonymous source meaning anyone could have wrote it for any amount of possible reasons
>people read one story posted on a blog and people automatically assume his guilt though no evidence proves it
>people are openly taking part in a witch hunt with zero evidence to back up their hatred
>people act like women have no reason at all the make up rape claims though stories are published all the time about women doing so and never facing jail time for ruining a man’s life
>why should she have to post with her name? look at the backlash she’s receiving posting anonymously; she has to protect herself and her child.
>see above.
>i don’t see how you think the story is vague. she shouldn’t have to post specifics like that because we are not the authorities and this is not an investigation – THIS IS HER TRUTH.
>it does not state she went to hang out with the band AFTER the assault occurred; she was assaulted at the after party at a friend’s house.
>just because beth is the first person you’ve heard accuse jorge of something like this does not mean she IS the first; she’s not.
>a very small number of sexual assault victims press charges.
>what would a 30-something year old, anonymously posting wife and mother who is not in the industry have to gain from posting something like this? it’s not the casualties are the world’s biggest punk band.
>our evidence is the victim’s statement – beth told us what happened. we believe her because we believe she was victimized.
>again, evidence is her statement. when the victim of a sexual assault goes to the police, their only evidence is the victim’s statement. again, beth’s story is evidence enough.
>”all the time” is a HUGE freaking overstatement. the national sexual violence resource center states that 2-8% of sexual assault accusations are deemed false; if you do the research yourself, some of the reports come from less credible sources. so “all the time” is really not accurate at all.